The Weekend Greenie Bag - Is The Celtics/Lakers Rivalry Dead For Good?
Good morning everybody, and welcome to another edition of the Weekend Greenie Bag. We have a great batch of questions for this week, and for that I thank those who wrote in. Keep it coming. Things should start to pick up as we get closer and closer to the start of the season, so remember, tweet me using #GreenieBag or email to greenieceltsbag@gmail.com to join in on the fun.
Now, onto your questions
Damn you Amatayyyyyy what a diabolical question. It brings up an interesting question in basically how much is your fandom worth. Personally, I can’t even fathom a life without the Boston Celtics. They truly consume every day of my life. To have that completely wiped away is terrifying. At the same time, $4 million dollars is a ridiculous amount of money. With that kind of cash your life can be pretty sweet for a variety of reasons. For example would I really miss the Celtics if I just took that money and moved to an island or something? I know the hardo thing to say is “absolutely no dollar amount could make me give up my favorite team” but shit, if someone put even $2 million cash in front of you, chances are you take that.
At 29 lets be generous and say I have like 50 years or so left of a functioning brain. In the last 50 years, the Celtics have won nine championships. I want to say there’s no chance I miss out on those coming titles, but my quality of life improves too much to pass up.
Final answer: I take it, but I’m never truly happy
Yeesh, we start with a question where I give up my favorite thing in the entire world, now I have to think about how many years of Tommy I have left? Quite possibly the most depressing Greenie Bag of all time. Mike, myself and most likely anyone who has watched a Celtics game over the last 30+ years agree with you that Mike and Tommy are the best thing to happen to our lives maybe ever. They are basketball royalty who have been the voice of what it means to be a Celtics fan for generations. I’ve lived in places like Arizona and Colorado, watch hours of League Pass, and I am confident in saying there may not be a duo that even comes close to matching what Mike and Tommy bring. Hearing Gorman call the Olympics gave me all sorts of feels and you’re right, the clock is ticking.
I think you’ve already started to see the transition for a post-Tommy world, since he no longer goes on the road for the most part, and I don’t see that role changing until Tommy physically can’t even do home games. You know how old people do a job for forever then the minute they stop, they die? The Celts are probably keeping him alive. All those “diet cokes” on the sideline are what give his big old green heart the strength to go on. God bless him.
And yes, I do think things shift towards Scal, if he takes it. Personally, I’m a huge Scal guy. I know he gets a mixed bag of reviews when he does games, but I love the White Mamba. I’m also not really sure who else could possibly fill that role. Obviously guys like Sean Grande would be incredible, but he already does a fantastic job on the radio, and plays the same role as Gorman. Maybe Cornbread gets a shot at TV? I dunno, but I am all for Scal to continue to carry the torch.
Email: Hey Greenie. I’ve had intense conversations with people on who we would rather get in a trade: Jahlil Okafor or Nerlens Noel. One is somewhat injury prone and the other knocks people out for telling him his last place team sucks. What are your thoughts on who would be better in Boston under Brad – Max
Ahh the trade that just won’t die. The 76ers with too many big men in need of a guard, and the Celtics with too many point guards and are in need of a big man, yet here we are with no trade. Both young players have their own set of pros and cons, and each would provide the Celtics with a certain set of skills that they desperately need. For example, Noel provides them with a young athletic big man who can defend the rim, and run the floor. On the other hand, Okafor is 1000x the offensive player Noel is, but his rebounding and defense leave you wanting more.
When I think of how the Celtics play, and the type of players they choose to move forward with, and the type of player they just rim themselves of, the play for me is Nerlens Noel. When I think of Celtics big man needs, first and foremost they need to be able to protect the rim. I’ll take Noel’s 3.9 BLK% to Okafor’s 2.9%. I also need that player to be able to rebound, especially defensively. Give me Noel’s 22.2 DREB% over Okafor’s 17.8%. With how this team is constructed (and obviously based on whatever is left after this trade happens) I think you take the gamble that you can help Noel develop some sort of offensive game given all the other positives he brings. Also, bringing him back home to MA is just icing on the cake.
Email: What are your thoughts of the current state of the Celtics/Lakers rivalry and do you see it returning to its former glory? Post Kobe Lakers will definitely be difficult to hate and even harder to respect, but D’Angelo Russell isn’t the worst guy to hate for no reason. But I actually kind of like Ingram and Clarkson so it’s weird. I think it’s like the Sox/Yankees team. The bad blood will bubble once both ream really come into their own and reach their full potential, but thats just a maybe. Do you really think the rivalry will ever reignite completely?
Thanks for taking the time to read this and for putting out off the great, in depth Celtics #content, keep it up! Viva – James
James is right, things have changed. Newer NBA fans might not realize how weird it is that there isn’t a white hot Celts/Lakers rivalry, obviously given their history. The Lakers making 60 playoff appearances in 69 franchise years, and Boston 53 in 71. I know they call this a rivalry, but it’s actually pretty one sided. Boston has the all time head to head lead (198-159) which includes a postseason record of 43-31. They’ve met in the Finals 12 times, and the Celts have won 9, but LA has won 3* of the last 4 meetings. These two franchises 100% saved the NBA, and it is a little sad that now in 2016, things are pretty different.
Here’s the thing. There have been “dips” in this rivalry before. After Magic/Bird retired, there wasn’t really a rivalry in the 90s. The Celtics were poopoo. Sure they may have not liked each other when they played, but it wasn’t the same sort of matchup of the decade prior. Well, things eventually swung back around with Kobe, and the Big 3 and that had a good run. The Lakers were winning 57+ games, the Celtics were winning 57+, it finally got that rivalry going. That’s the key. In order for the Celts/Lakers to truly get back to that level, both teams need to be really really good. Unfortunately, neither are there, yet. What made this matchup so great was the fact that these two teams were titans of the league, and I don’t think it’s crazy to say that both teams have quite a ways to go in order to achieve that status in 2016.
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In terms of hateable players, they still have em, don’t let yourself be fooled. I know personally I still hate the Lakers, but now that Kobe is gone, perhaps that changes, but most likely not. Until that beautiful time comes where both teams are dominating the NBA, as a fanbase we will have to rely on the fumes of the past to keep this rivalry alive, but even calling it that feels odd. At least the Celtics are doing their part to get back to the top of the mountain, the Lakers are a complete mess and should be relegated to the D-League if you ask me. Fuck em.
Luke, if you’re trying to get me to take the bait, I’ll do it. The answer is Isaiah Thomas. To the media/basketball hardos he is 100% undervalued. That’s the easy answer.
Isaiah aside, I have to go with his Tacoma Twin Avery Bradley. I’m not sure people realize how good and how important Avery has become. Who knows if it’s his quiet demeanor or what, but we all saw how important was once he went down in the Atlanta series last year. He gives you elite All NBA defense, he’s probably your best 3P shooter, he can’t pass, but rebounds well for his position, and to top it all off, he’s just 25. You see NBA players all the time tweet out their respect after facing Avery and how legit he is, if he has a big year this year I think maybe people start to notice nationally. If not, fine by me, happy to slide under the radar.
Email: Hey Greenie, loving the #CelticsBag and hopefully this and the interaction with the fans will make Portnoy bring you on full time. Anyways, I was wondering what do you think about IT’s contract extension. At this point right now, if you’re Ainge, do you pay the man? And what would make you say that he’s asking for too much, and to let him walk? Thanks for everything Celtics! – Ryan
First off Ryan, it’s called the #GreenieBag, smh help a blogger help build a brand would ya please.
Now this is a great question, because the clock is ticking and this is a decision that is going to have to be made very quickly. Isaiah’s current deal is in the same crazy universe of Steph Curry’s $11M a year. INSANE VALUE. He signed a 4 yr/$27M contract, and what’s interesting is the yearly amount decreases each year. Isaiah is only making $6.2M this year, or in other words, Evan Turner is making almost 3 times as much. That’s crazy.
Would I pay him? Absolutely, if he keeps playing at this level. I know people were a bit sensitive about my SI player list blog, but the reality is that Isaiah has played at an elite level during his entire time in Boston, and if he repeats it this year, that makes 2.5 full seasons of elite PG play. You reward that. But it’s that idea that makes this resigning challenging.
There was a time when I said Harrison Barnes was going to get the max, apparently I didn’t know anything about basketball, then he got a 4yr/$94M max deal. Evan Turner got a billion dollars. Mike Conley signed the biggest contract in NBA history or some shit like that. Whether you feel these players are worth it or not, everyone is getting paid. You put up the production IT has, you should get your share. When the Celtics maxed Al Horford, people cried saying he’s not a max player, but that way of thinking is outdated. If you have the money and you need to spend it, suddenly more people become “max” players.
Since he’ll be an unrestricted FA, the Celtics need to make up their mind soon on what they want to do, or they could find themselves in a situation where IT decides to just take his talents to the open market. You certainly can’t lowball him given the deal he’s currently playing under, and how much Isaiah has embraced being a Celtic. My fear is that they come to the table early with a much lower than market value offer, sort of like the Sox did with Lester.
Pay Isaiah early, and pay him whatever he wants, as long as you still have the flexibility to continue to build your roster. Isaiah is a special and effective player, I don’t care if you have Smart/Rozier/Jackson on the roster. They’re good, but they aren’t a gawd.
And that will do it for this week’s Greenie Bag. With 38 days until the season starts, and training camp just a few weeks away, things are starting to feel real, and as you sit at work and try and contain your excitement, know that you aren’t alone, and let me be your outlet. To those who wrote in, thank you again, and to those who haven’t, well, what are you waiting for. Until next week everybody, have a fantastic weekend